Pathetic Payrises… But oil at all time high..

[Tak_Tahu_Lah]

Well did a quick survey of mates and the concensus is all the companies are taking the pi**

At a time when there is a Worldwide shortage of experienced personel and oil is at an all time high…. What was the average pay rise ?

Around 3%

They offered the council workers about the same and they are now on strike…

If only it was as easy for ROV guys to do the same…

So with inflation at anywhere from 5% and up (depends who you believe) and the cost of everything in the shops rising daily we are on our way backwards..

Guess they figure we all need the money too badly to complain…

Maybe if we wain another 12 Months they will give us a few pennies extra..

Worst I’ve heard so far is Sonsub/Saipem – less than 3% – least it was backdated till Jan 🙄

Any companies out there even tighter and stingier than Sonsub ?

(Not inc OI cos their pay is shite to start with) 😉

[Scott Beveridge]

Hey D. dude,

You know where I’m at and where I won’t go… but the company I’m presently working for has done pretty well the past 2 years but are starting to lag behind again. Did the usual moaning, pushing and the normal threats to no avail. But inflation and the TOTALLY SH+TE dollar has put us back to our rate to pre-New Years annual raise. With the price of oil the way it is and the dayrates some of the service companies are getting, one would think (without naivety) that they’d actually pass some of it on to the real workers instead of giving themselves raises. Loyalty is a 2 way street… Agreed?

[James McLauchlan]

Earlier this year TSMarine came up with around 3%. One PT grade had no pay rise at all. As a result people have left. No surprise there.

The price of oil has gone through the roof over the last year, gas is following and the cost of living is going up also. Simply reviewing pay once a year and hoping to get by, by awarding that level of rise is tantamount to daylight robbery. On the other hand you see oil & gas related companies announcing record profits.

There needs to be more regular reviews on pay to keep pace with real world markets. No wonder the industry is having trouble attracting people into it.

Something isn’t quite right with the system that’s for sure.

I feel simply mentioning the ‘strike’ word is not the immediate solution but I’m not quite sure what is at present.

[Tak_Tahu_Lah]

Yep… That’s the point any ‘payrise’ has been eroded by inflation.. Wouldn’t be so bad if it kept pace with inflation but in reality we are earning less than last year… add currency fluctation and it’s worse..

Just don’t know how they justify such small percentages when their revenues and profits are massive… Too many bums on seats in the office and too much money wasted on paper chasers… meanwhile the guys at the coalface are getting shafted…

One pay revue a year and then it’s a pittance… Dunno about strikes but I’d love to see a whole 12 man crew walk off of refuse to return.. There are only so many guys available… especially experienced ones that can actually do the job..

[Scott Beveridge]

Drilling rigs are getting dayrates from anywhere between $150 – $420 per MINUTE…. And guess what a new roustabout (expat) is getting???

[James McLauchlan]

Idiotic posts deleted

Didn’t take long!

How the are we supposed to discuss stuff when it immediately degenerates into glib one liners?

For the guilty ones…… Either respond sensibly or don’t post. It’s not a hard decision to make.

If you want to piss around start a thread up of your own and do just that but don’t hijack a new thread and wreck it.

Yes…. I deleted the childish posts. They were not even remotely funny.

[Savante]

CHALLENGE!!!

Need some posts on working out how much you’d need (as an American living in the US being paid in Euros) in pay rises in 2004 to 2008 to have the same quality of life as an American in 2004.

Consider.

1. How much inflation has eroded your salaries in 2008 compared to 2004.

2. How much the weakened dollar has made it easier for a european company to pay in euros for an american IF inflation is passed onto the client.

I just tried, but my conclusions were confusing me. I ran through the following.

Think an american on 100$/day now needs 114$/day to be at same level of life quality in 2004.

Think it’s 37% drop in pain for a company to pay that 100$/day taking into account inflation and euro:dollar exchange rates. (Assuming that company can pass inflation onto the client!). I took the best dollar to euro in 2004 and worst in 2008 – makes the change significant.

I.e 2004 – 83.3euro/day for a 100$/day worker at worst
2008 – 63.3 euro/day for a 100$/day worker at best

this is 24.1% drop in pain for euro-company if the american keeps on earning 100$/day.

However, to have the same quality of life for the american.

Now need 72 Euro’s day for that same american quality of life at 114$/day. If inflation costs are passed onto the client………. those euro’s now are only worth 91% of their 2004 value.

So if the company "feels" the same financial burden in 2008, then it’d have paid 82euros/day.

Hmmm. Head starting to hurt…..

What I think this is saying is that dollar:euro exchange rate is such that if you are a US worker earning the same in euros now as in 2004, then you are living at the same quality of life as in 2004- it just offsets inflation in the states. Any pay rises in euros therefore directly equates to increase in your quality of life.

[Savante]

also this assumes that inflation is accurate measure of how you live your life.

Mine is not reflective- high fuel expenditure for one thing and cold winters.

[Cabledog]

Christ Sav,

My head hurts just reading that, going for a snooze 😯

[Savante]

I had three attempts to do that….. 😥 and now my eyesight is a little fuzzy.

[pipetracker]

I’m still trying to digest Sav’s analysis but I like to keep things simple so I see it like this. Imagine you are a company that has a service/product that is much in demand. Does it make sound buisness sense to agressively bid for work when there is such a high demand. I don’t think so. For 1:0 it leaves you no margin to cover the inevitable cock-ups that occur because your staff are de-motivated by the meagre pay increase they’ve just been awarded and 2:) You can’t attract the quality of personnel that at the end of the day you need to deliver a quality product/service. Maybe somebody should try the approach that the building trade have been using for years. Stick in a ridiculous quote for the job and the client will be so desperate he’ll happily pay……wait a minute, maybe that’s exactly what they’re doing. To cut through the waffle I don’t believe that the major subsea operators are doing the gentlemanly thing and trying not to profiteer out of this current boom so I’d like my piece of the cake now so that I have some reserves in the bank when it all comes crashing down.

[Savante]

Not absolutely confident about the maths to be honest!! I never studied economics so maybe I’ve got it a bit tooo simple; there’s probably all sorts of witch-craft that economists use.

economics 101: make hay whilst the sun shines!

[Cabledog]

economics 101: make hay whilst the sun shines!

true, so what is 102, etc etc. Stow the hay in the barn or have a feed straight away 😕

[Scott Beveridge]

Hence, coming back to the OP (Tak’s) post of the miserable average of a pay raise (annual) of approx. 3% throughout the industry and the companies miserable excuses of why they can only give out those crumbs. Pipetracker hit the nail on the head (in the simplistic form) after Sav’s number-crunching venture (ouch!). The harsh reality of it all is: a.) the majority of the worlds rigs and ALL types of vessels are being utilized b.) (a wild guess – correct me if I’m wrong) 95% of the worlds ROV systems are being utilized and more coming into service every week..!! c.) mid to hi tech manufacturers supplying the offshore industry (ies) are flat out working overtime and / or working 24/7 just to meet the demand of orders (try to get some rental gear without lead time!!)

And once again the full circle… the never-ending struggle between the working stiff and the chair polishers…

[James McLauchlan]

I feel the problem lies with the fact that there is not a group negotiating on behalf of ROV personnel. Part of that is the fault of the ROV personnel themselves when they fail to take up on invitations to join a body that would be able to negotiate on their behalf.

On the one hand ROV people are often quick to knock such an organisation (which may seem clever at the time, but is indeed short sighted) but on the other hand they are equally as quick to complain when divers (for example) get a huge pay rise and ROV rates are left behind.

Divers grouped together, joined a uni0n then negotiated from a position of strength. Around here, people can’t even agree on which uni0n to join!
We ran a poll on which/type of uni0n people should/would join.
Whilst the poll result indicated an overall majority in favour of a maritime uni0n there was still a split. That certainly does not bode well for ROV as a group for sure.

By not joining a Uni0n and by not having appointed representation you are leaving the ROV industry (from a personnel point of view) as nothing other than a collection of uncoordinated individuals. This is of course a situation which companies are more than happy to allow as they are then able to dictate rates to individuals on a ‘take it or leave it’ basis and offer such rises as the 3% mentioned above.

In a nutshell. For some time now ROV people have had a good opportunity to do something about this situation.

I feel there is no sense at all in complaining about rates when pretty much nobody has bothered to do anything about changing the situation.

If you are a Uni0n member you have every right to feel unhappy about the situation as you are paying money for a group to represent you and look after your needs.
If you are not and you are complaining then have a rethink about your strategy is my suggestion.

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