Home Forums ROV ROV Rookie Corner Some advice to all trainees looking for a start.

Some advice to all trainees looking for a start.

Home Forums ROV ROV Rookie Corner Some advice to all trainees looking for a start.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 47 total)
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  • #2125
    effinreps
    Participant

    RTFF, RTFF and most importantly RTFF.

    Quizzical looks? Don’t understand? Let me explain! When you get offshore you will hear no end of 3 and 4 letter acronyms, but as a trainee, the one you will hear most is RTFM, Read The F***ing Manual.

    The manual contains an abundance of useful information, and in most cases will answer all your questions and help you fix the problem. In much the same way as this Forum contains all the information you need to get a start.

    The questions and answers in various guises, such as. How do I get a start? What’s the trick to get in? Who do I approach? Is x ROV course any good? Have been repeated ad nauseum in ROOKIE CORNER, and annoyingly in the general forum.

    To fit in to this job and to be a useful member of a crew requires as a minimum:-

    1) A good PRACTICAL technical background (Electronics, electrical or hydraulic).
    2) Ability to learn a multitude of new skills quickly.
    3) Problem solving ability.
    4) Common sense.
    5) Initiative.

    If you genuinely possess all of the above, and you are able to get all your questions answered using this Forum without posting a repeat question under a different title then go for it. Do not waste your money on an ROV course, you will learn more in 2 or 3 shifts than you ever will on any course. If you want to spend money on helping to get a start do your survival and medical! It won’t be easy getting a start in the current climate but you may be lucky.

    So stop posting and RTFF

    If you have not worked out RTFF the below applies to you!

    REALITY CHECK FOR ALL OTHERS.

    If you do not possess ALL 5 in the list above, stop dreaming and get on with your current job.

    There is a slow down coming, in fact it has already started. The people who will feel it first are the incompetent, the unqualified and trainees, and the reason is simple. Over the last few years the ROV companies have been sending out trainees by the bucket load as there has been a shortage of experienced guys to go around. When the supervisor/superintendant complains that he does not want 3 or 4 trainees in a 6 man team the office have said “there is no one else available”. This is about to change as contracts get cancelled and the work slows down there will be more experienced and qualified guys to go round.

    I for 1 am very happy about this slow down as it will weed out all the dross that has entered the industry recently. By this I do not mean trainees with the right background, but the plethora of wannabe ex hairdressers, street sweepers, infantry men, brickies, carpenters etc that have invaded/infected the industry recently. There is nothing wrong with those jobs, they are useful jobs that are required by all developed countries. However they are not relevant to the ROV industry. A trainee with the right background on his first trip is far more useful on shift than any of the above with some experience. The majority of the above mentioned hairdresser etc, end up being nothing more than highly paid winch operators/tea boys. These people have been very happy getting a good wage for doing c*ck all, for far too long, however the gravy train is about to pull into the station.

    All the people that have been along for a free ride are going to find it increasingly difficult to find work. The people that will weather the storm, are those that are productive and contribute to the effective and efficient running of a shift with their technical and operational abilities, whether they are trainees or guys with 1 or 2 years experience.

    The “TRAINING SCHOOLS”

    1) Are any of the training schools charities? NO they are businesses. What is the purpose of a business? To make money for their owners/share holders. Nothing more nothing less.

    2) How does a business work? On the laws of supply and demand. As long as there is a demand for courses these “schools” will keep supplying them. Unfortunately the demand is from people who want to get into the industry not from ROV operators.

    3) Are there any ethical “schools” out there? To answer this try to find out how many have cut back on the amount of courses being run this year. From my research NONE!

    4) All technical training courses require minimum levels of education/experience. The schools will say that all candidates are vetted to assess suitability. If you have spoken to any of these schools what questions have you been asked other than “have you got the money”

    5) Do any of the schools offer the option of paying a % of the course fees up front and the remainder from future earnings. Surely if they believed in their product, the vetting procedure and the availability of work this would be an obvious option for such an expensive course.

    6) OPITO approved claims, are false, OPITO approves nothing. It simply publishes guidelines for the O&G industry.

    7) These training establishments portray this job as quite glamorous with worldwide travel good pay and 6 months off per year etc! How glamorous is lying under a sub in freezing temperatures when it’s pi**ing down with rain and your covered in hydraulic oil in the middle of the N. sea? Or being abandoned by an agent at the airport of a war torn country where life is cheaper than a packet of crisps?

    8) You need to ask yourself,

    • “If this it is such a great job with all the perks advertised. How are these “training schools” able to recruit instructors?”
    • Have any of these instructors got any teacher training qualifications?
    • Most of the major players run their own training schools, so why the need for a private one?

    9) The training “schools” will sell their courses on the huge employment “potential” of this industry.

    A young lad asks his Dad about the difference between potential and reality.
    The Dad says “Go ask your Mum if she would sleep with George Clooney for a million quid”
    The lad comes back and says “she said yes”
    Dad “Go and ask your sister if she would sleep with Ronaldo for a million quid”
    The lad comes back and says “she said yes”
    The Dad says “That’s the difference son, POTENTIALLY we could be millionaires the REALITY is we live with a couple of slappers.

    SNAKE OIL: An expression applied metaphorically to any product with exaggerated marketing, but questionable or unverifiable quality or benefit.

    END OF RANT 😀

    #21498
    Scott Beveridge
    Participant

    Nice rant dude, real nice!!!! :tup: :tup:

    #21499
    effinreps
    Participant

    Thanks Scot 😀

    Bad shift needed to let off steam 😡 😡

    Feel much better now 😆

    #21500
    thinsub
    Participant

    Nice one bud, could not have put it better myself.

    #21501
    Cabledog
    Participant

    Eff,

    That has to be one of the most thought out and eloquent post on here in a long time.

    At least I hope it was though out 8)

    Stay safe all
    Dog

    #21502
    Bonesplus
    Participant

    I understand and appreciate that what you have written, but also feel that those of you (not ALL of you) that already have a job in your choice of career, tend to take it a little for granted….

    I understand that you will have trainees arrive – which your superiors have considered a good choice – that are not as good as they first seem, and when it come to their actual mettel, they have nothing to offer….maybe you should stop hitting a those guys and aim for the selection process….although my time in the Foces tought me that shit roles easier downhill!!!

    My point and case….
    I consider myself a pretty good bet as far as this career is concerned..I completed a number of years in the army, as a plant operator mechanic, so hand eye coordination is checked. not happy with just "driving" the plant kit, changed career to plant fitter….not only could I operate the kit, I had a good understanding on how the thing is put together…….so hydraulics and mechainics are also checked.
    Having left the forces, I now work for a company as a HGV mechanic, covering hydraulics, mechanics and, (all-be-it basic) vehicle born electronics and electrics….to add to this I have a proven record of my ability to learn new skills fast, and in arduous conditions, ranging from antarctic to arctic and everywhere in-between…..
    YOUR superiors decide to take on the bloke who’s spent all his time in a university dorm learning the theoretic world, but with no clue on it’s real world content!!!

    Again, I understand that it’s frustrating for you old hats to have a trainee constantly asking (in your opinion) stupid and pointless questions, but give those blokes a break, it is afterall your employers that have put them there!!!!

    #21503
    Bonesplus
    Participant

    It seems that I may have been misunderstood. (my inbox!!!)

    I mean no offence to anyone, I merely wanted to point out that all personell have been chosen as the best applicant by a "higher being". perhaps that "higher being" is the place to let your frustration out on…

    #21504
    ROVRatt
    Participant

    An eloquent rant. Well done Effinreps. Couldn’t have put it better myself.

    Maybe a point to mention the conditions in hotter parts of the world where your coverall fades from being in the sun and there is a micro weather system in your hard hat that causes it to rain inside your hat. Somehow your neck and ears wind up red after maintaining the TMS. Then you can’t get the number tags over wires because your hands are sweaty, like the rest of your body while the weather system under your hat rains on the wires in your hands and the client insists on full coveralls – no short sleeves.

    Then you start to repair the light that caused the ground fault and after taking it into the air conditioned workshop you test the light fitting with a Megger and it shows virtual continuity between the earth and power supply conductors. The ex infantryman then suggests you get the circuit diagram for the light out because you have a strange problem….

    Then the guy who told you he has an electrical background and is being examined by the supervisor for a competency task hurriedly comes and asks you what the symbols on the multimeter selector mean……

    Then while getting ready to calibrate the torque tool the tooling tech from another company taps you on the shoulder and points. You look and notice the supposed electrical boffin cleaning the camera lenses with WD40.

    Wonder if they mention this at training schools?

    James, may I suggest that you make Effinreps’ rant a sticky for those that want to get into ROV to read?

    #21505
    Bonesplus
    Participant

    rovratt, surely this highlights the failures of the selection process?

    #21506
    ROVRatt
    Participant

    Bonesplus wrote:

    surely this highlights the failures of the selection process?

    Not really, it actually highlights the buddy system and political imperitaves imposed by certain countries.

    #21507
    Bonesplus
    Participant

    aha, good to hear the familiar "it’s not what you know, it’s who you know that matters". I just wish I knew someone, sick of the decliation letters!!!

    #21508
    effinreps
    Participant

    Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaggggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!

    The prosecution rests your Honour.

    Bones,

    Bit of advice, stop passing comment on an industry you have little or no knowledge of. You have no concept of the way some of these people end up offshore. It is certainly not as a result of an exhaustive interview process.

    Example: 2 pm Friday afternoon,

    Secretary: “Joe Blogs needs to get off the “Rusty Tub” on compassionate grounds”
    Ops Manager: “Who’s available?”
    Secretary: “No one, they are all offshore or not answering their phones”
    Ops Manager: “Sh*t, I haven’t got time for this, I’m playing golf in half an hour. Try them all again, do withheld number”
    Secretary: “Still no answer”
    O M: “Tw*ts! Right get the emergency only CV’s out, try all the ones with valid survival and medical. First one that answers the phone goes on the job. Right I’m off I’ll have to buy the first round on the 19th if I’m late”

    I guess you have had 1 or 2 comments pm’d from other members less tolerant than myself, that might be a clue.

    #21509
    Bonesplus
    Participant

    Eff, that’s right isn’t it??? having RTFF..

    forgive my ignorance….your right, I know nothing of the ROV industry….but I am sure that all on here where in this boat at some point.

    the "system" or "Politics" that you stated as a friday afternoon run of the mill, are the same across the board, we all have them….however you cannot blame the person who decides to take advantage of them…i’m sure you have taken advantage from time to time too….

    again, I understand and sympthise with your position…..but remember…who put that "infantryman" or "electronics backgound" by your side???

    #21510
    ROVRatt
    Participant

    Hi Bonesplus

    Please allow me to elaborate. It’s not the norm in the industry but these buddy-buddy guys do (did) get in as trainees and the political imperative employees are unavoidable. I think the days of hairdressers, brickies, infantrymen and those with the proper handshake getting in are gone. I believe that they will also not be there much longer with the downturn.

    When I was recruited there were about 60 applicants that got to the interview stage and 9 got in. None of these 9 guys were known to the recruiters and each guy had verifiable technical qualifications.

    The buddy system seems to have been confined to certain geographical regions as well. With the downturn I believe that companies will definitely looking for quality rather than family.

    Good luck with a start.

    #21511
    effinreps
    Participant

    Bones

    Your assertion that the Friday afternoon scenario is run of the mill is ridiculous. Yes there will be the POETS (p*ss off early tomorrow’s Saturday) thing going on, but placing untrained, unqualified people in a highly technical job as part of a small team at the last minute?

    Nah, can you see a road sweeper being drafted in to be an ambulance driver just because he has a driving licence? Or maybe a butcher being used in a heart transplant team, because he can use a sharp knife? Would you allow the landlord of your local to fix your gas boiler because he has experience attaching pipes to a barrel?

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