IMCA certificate vs ROV certificate

[piper]

I have been fortunate enough to be requested that I submit these on two (2) separate incidents. What exactly can anyone tell me about these? It seems a request especially from Asian countries. 😕

[James McLauchlan]

To the best of my recollection, and unless anything has shifted of late, the IMCA does not issue certificates for ROV personnel.

However, IMCA does issue guidelines for ROV training. An ROV training establishment (anyone could start one of those tomorrow if they wish) may issue an ROV training certificate indicating that a certain person has attended/passed an ROV training course that was structured around IMCA ROV training guidelines. That certificate can no way be construed as an IMCA Certificate but I could imagine why a training establishment would wish a certificate to look like it was issued by IMCA so, to that end, you may see the IMCA logo appear on the cert.

Further to that. It appears that, although the IMCA issues training guidelines, as a Marine Contractors association the IMCA does not regulate the standard of the training facilities nor training carried out at those facilities.

Anyone/Company (you included) can issue an ‘ROV certificate’ as it is not a legal document and is barely be worth the paper it is written on.

Please remember that, unlike diving, the ROV industry is not governed by any legal requirements for training and certification in the manner that Diving is.
Also bear in mind that the IMCA is not a government appointed body in any country. The IMCA is a subscription based association (read cosy club) of business entities bandied together by way of protecting/promoting their own commercial interests in the International Marine Contracting Environment.

Concerning ROV…The above sad state of affairs (lack of regulation) has come about because those that operate within the ROV industry have neither the will nor wherewithal to regulate their own industry themselves so, by default, it’s fallen to the IMCA to fill the gap.

[piper]

Thanks James that is the understanding I have had all the time but somehow quite some reputable ROV companies put it in their requests when looking for personnel. Strange, there is actually an active advert posted in today that wants " valid IMCA certificate". The mind boggles 😕

[deepseacon]

In the last 8 years i just send my Course Cert the one after the 3 weeks Rov course that gets past all the Employers HR and Rov cordinators ops managers etc & clients and agents they use this i never been refused this method when asked i send it.

i get asked quite a bit as i freelance.

anyone who takes a course has one if not you get signed of in the rov book same thing anyone can get signed off there as there is no one to check.

thats why its so easy to get into Rov you can become a Rov crew member in less than 4 weeks working then offshore.

which is why companies like fugro ME are looking for crew for bombay high paying 425 usd for techs but they want 3 exp and mech and elec and sealion experence they want to apply visa’s so they want international crew.

just the same when it comes to Dive Techs they still ask for pay grading cert which was retracted years ago by imca dive companies still ask for it basically imca is the problem.

need something like JIB which sparks have they have people to audit all the certs before you get graded.

[senior]

Another phishing/fishing e-mail just in asking for IMCA Certs???, hmm, As far as I am aware Imca set the guidelines and thats all!

I found the info on the pages below.

http://www.imca-int.com/divisions/rov/profile/personnel/competence/

http://www.imca-int.com/core/ct/profile/competence/faqs.html

Here’s the e-mail…..

Good Afternoon,

I’m getting in touch as I potentially have a long term contract starting at the end of Feb/ March.

I will need IMCA ROV Supervisors (5+ years’ experience), IMCA ROV P/T with work class experience(Perry, SMD, Schilling) on IRM type projects.

I will need about 5 Supervisors, 12 ROV P/T. Both Pilot’s and Supervisors will need to have IMCA certs.

I am still awaiting more details but as mentioned this project still needs to be confirmed.

If you are available and interested to hear more about this job then please let me know.

Regards,

[andyrose]

Hi guys,

The same old subject matter seems to be coming up again and again.

James has pointed out the situation very clearly and accurately as I understand it. There is no mystery about it. IMCA, in the absence of any other credible body, has issued guidelines.

The requirement for a certificate is not driven by the agencies it is driven by the clients. If a client requires some certification then the agencies (and presumably the contracting companies) will have to comply if they want to bid for, and have a chance of getting, the jobs.

Until the ROV industry members remove their heads from up their arses and manage to agree on a tangible representation for ourselves then it is pointless moaning about it. You would be far better to spend your time and effort getting a certificate relevant to the position you want.

Like it or not this position will not get any easier, in fact I would predict that, in a very short timesacle. the OGP’s will insist on certification (otherwise I cannot see many of the ROV companies bearing the cost of IMCA membership if it brings no benefit to them) and further that, due to the position they hold in relation to diving and regulation of the sector, IMCA wil be the body used.

Sorry to be blunt about this but – unless we have the will to change this situation then – shut the fuck up and accept it.

Having seen the apathy and lack of support received, for the only two real efforts to resolve our current plight, I doubt that we will ever have enough unity to achieve the same the divers have. The longer we remain divided the more the contracting companies will laugh and take the money that should be in our pockets.

It is called life – it may not be fair but until we take decisive action we will be controlled and at the everybody elses whims.

Andy

[Mike Kidd]

If you have a competence certificate for the position that you are applying for and that competence has been carried out by an IMCA registered company then surely your certificate is of an IMCA standard and therefore an IMCA certificate. So day raters will have to pay someone like MTS to assess their competence and issue certification to be able to work offshore.

If you worked on gas fittings and boilers at home you need to get registered as Gas safe before you work so why shouldn’t we be the same?

[senior]

I undertand that gas fitters ( posh plumbers) are regulated and exams are taken for them to be Identified as gas fitters, But there are no governing bodies for Roving, Such as Corgi for the Gas fitters, or when we undertake our survivals or medicals!

Therefore Imca’s guidelines are that! and that only, As they are not policed or are they sanctioned or recognised in anyway, Its just the clients or agencies requesting the latest "buzz certificate", just like MIST.

I am a spark, and I sat recognised exams, sat numerous modules, EITB, Entra, city and guilds, HNc ect ect, the ROV game is not policed at all, it should be in my opinion. 💡

Our jobs would be a lot simpler if we all sat exams and had recognised qualifications, and then we could all agree on wage stuctures, instead of every tom dick and harry undercutting the rest, due to their inability to be frugal. 😥

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