seafarers earnings deduction, taxman headache

[Buffel]

Just to keep all informed,this issue continues unabated…UKPS have sent a letter to someone higher up the food chain at Centre 1 regarding this issue,highlighting the inconsistancies in the responses from Centre 1 and Norwich and also those from within Centre 1 itself.the reply has come back as wooly and unhelpful as usual,with UKPS now suggesting only two remaining options,the first being the requirement for them to have a face to face with Centre 1 and should that fail then the final option is the Commisioners,at which point UKPS say that all correspondence that they have including the letter from Norwich stating that for the purposes of tax,PAYE personnel were to be considered EMPLOYED.We can only hope! I am still coming across UKPS PAYE people who are oblivious to this situation and it’s potential repurcussions,which is a worry…..

[ROV_Monkey]

Buffel,
Do you know how far back the taxman is looking? I used to work for UKPS probably about 9 – 10 years ago.

Regds

Monkey

[Buffel]

Monkey,there are currently around 40 people under investigation for this. I have had yet another demand from Centre 1 for basically what amounts to a job spec and conditions,the same issues as they have been supplied with since this issue started in May this year.SK Tax have decided that we are going around in circles,UKPS approaches to HMRC have amounted to nothing and been no more succesful than SK tax in persuading diplomatically that HMRC are in the wrong.So SK TAX have replied stating that again that they consider me to have been employed and that the case should be closed on that basis or they will take the case before the Commisioners.UKPS have a letter from the Regional director of HMRC for East Anglia stating that for tax purposes we were employed,which they say that if they took the case to the commsioners they would lay out all correspondence,things have I feel moved beyond UKPS and the face to face meeting and its time to lay all this before the Commissioners.
In answer to your direct question,I believe that if you have been investigated for a specific year then you cannot be investigated for that year again,any other is fair game,so should this go against us it will be open season,sorry! if the tax man finds any issue he can go back to the day you began work……we shall see what happens next there are very few options left open.I am lucky,if it goes badly then I am faced with only part of one year,others could face years worth of back payments.be afraid,be very afraid.

[Buffel]

UKPS have now ended all attempts to resolve this issue.They say that HMRC will only deal with this issue on an individual basis (how,we were either self employed or we were not,one person PAYE cannot be different to another!!).I have had a holding letter back from HMRC now saying that they are considering the points that my accountant has raised pointing out why they considered me to be employed,failing a positive outcome from this my only recourse will have to be the Commissioners.Dont know if there is any legal course that could be taken after that, may need to get in touch with the unions employment lawyers.

Bluemoon,what was the outcome of your case or is it like myself and Numpty "ongoing"

Looks like there are no reasons to stay agency PAYE. oh how did the conversation go "would you like to be PAYE or Self Employed"! looks like there is no difference except in one you get screwed.

[Anonymous]

Dont be afraid.Just tell the taxman to stick it up his Jacksie once your
sitting under that coconut tree supping tanduay and cokes,thats what
I did. F–K the taxman………….Who needs to live in that rip off shite
hole anyway when your in this industry??….cheers time for me tanduay and coke……….

[Buffel]

Whilst I echo your sentiments Brigs, that is not exactly helpful! Some of us have wives and families so that is not really helpful or practical at the moment.Enjoy your drinky.

[Anonymous]

yeah sorry mate I know what you mean.I spent quite a few years working offshore and living in the Blighty hell hole and having to go through all the tax hassles etc.I have family there also,but enough was enough,just wasnt worth earning good money offshore and handing it over to those theiving buggers and getting nothing back in return except millons of eastern europeans.good thing is is in this industry dont have to pay those theives a single penny if you dont want to…..

[Buffel]

Well,thats that then.short of winning an appeal.I have recieved a demand from HMRC for all the tax back plus interest,giving me 30 days to pay or face an additional 5% surcharge.I also have 30 days to appeal,either to the local Commisioners or to the Special Commissioners in London.Thanks for that UKPS,looks like open season now on anybody PAYE agency,riggers,dpo’s ROV.

[Anonymous]

Buffel could you please clarify what you mean with all this.Do you
mean you worked for UKPS and they payed your tax for you PAYE,
and then you claimed it back under the seafarers deduction,and they
are now saying you were self employed and asking you to pay it back
again??,if this is the case I would tell them to ram it and get the money
off of UKPS who were responsible for your PAYE when you were working
for them.If you are self employed can you claim the seafarers deduction,
and if so probably better to do it that way.Bloody theiving Inland revenue hey.The more honest you are with that lot the more they bleed you dry..

[Buffel]

Brigs,yes I was PAYE with UKPS with tax and NI deducted at source so I was under the impression that I was in effect employed.As self employed you are not allowed to claim Seamans Earnings Deduction.The tax man wants his money NOW, I cannot tell him to ram it and claim it from UKPS much as I would love too,if I dont pay it within 30 days I have to pay an additional 5%.they have already put interest on top as it is!

I am not alone,there are currently appx 40 people going through this and it will be the opening of the floodgates, God help you if you have been getting your tax back agency paye for a few years!

So much for working Agency PAYE,they ask you if you want to be Self Employed or PAYE,if you go PAYE they give you a lower dayrate,but you are self employed anyway (which they dont tell you) so get none of the benifits of either.

Moral stay staff or go limited company,avoid PAYE agency work as you will get shafted.

[bluemoon]

UKPS, rumic & other agencies that operate a PAYE system without admiting your an employee and putting it in writing (check your contracts) have been taking your money for years its only a matter off time before your investigated by the HMRC and you too have too pay you’re taX back, for me it’s quite a few quid, for others its a fortune, do yourselves a favour and don’t work for UKPS and other agencies as they are only out to make a fortune for doing fu*k all on your expertise.

Question: how many agencies are any good?

my answer is none, I do the job why should they have such a huge cut when they do NOTHING for the workers.

[pipetracker]

OK so now everyone who works through an agency will either go limited company or go staff if they want to carry on claiming FED. Can anyone see further ramifications from this if you’re on one of these ex-pat Singapore style contracts (Acergy, Tecnip, etc). It sounds very similar in that, like UKPS, the companies operating these contracts don’t pay Employers NI AFAIK.

I count my blessings that I’m not in the same situation as those affected as with Christmas coming up this could not be happening at a worse time.

[Anonymous]

How on earth can this be.Oh of course this is rip off Blighty we r talking about.This wouldnt happen in any other country.How the f__k can these C__nts get away with it.You worked for an agency,did you have a contract with them to state that you were PAYE?,if not you should have done.I dont understand how they could have paid your tax for you,and then you claimed it back and then the c__nts turn around and say that you were self employed.If I was you i wouldnt give in on this.I would appeal at the bare minimum to the commisioner of taxes,and if that didnt work I would be appointing a solicitor and holding this agency accountable…..
Oh and if possible i highly recommend getting the hell out of that shite hole………….

[xxx]

To all those affected by the taxman. I have been chatting to my wife about the agency/taxman problems you are experiencing. She is involved in the legal profession. Her advice is to all band together and employ at good tax solicitor to construct a case against the taxmans claims. They can also request information from UKPS and prove the legal precidence that you and the agency both had a contractural implied understanding that you were employees. Basically the taxman tends to be a bully under these circumstances and the only way to stand up to him is to work together through a legal tax professional. Apparently there have been cases of this in other industries. Also UKPS has a legal side so I would expect to be of more help than they seem to be.

Good luck and keep us all informed of how it goes.

[xxx]

Apparently this is a specialist tax firm of solicitors in Glasgow who are used to fighting against the centre one crowd.

http://www.lemac.co.uk/company/index.html

[Author]

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