Do Divers make better Pilots ?

[Andy Shiers]

An interesting question that pops up every now and then 😕
Someone trying to get into the industry on another thread has said that he was a diver and would certainly know how to fly them 😛
I would say yes , A diver spends his time dragging his umbilical around and is always trying to get it in such a way that it does not get snagged on debris or pushed into something due to current.
I would say that it was a plus advantage but I would say also , most divers rely on the heavy handed approach when doing things up 😯
Ramming speed is not always good when flying a video inspection , Nor is overtightening a st/st bolt in to an aluminium thread 😯
Aggressive movements of the Joysticks causing springs to break.
Brains is also needed , How to read a compass is very helpful , Learn your headings in ya head 🙄 Having been on a barge or DSV and working on construction helps to put everything into perspective
The people that fail to be ROV pilots of some calibre are the morons that think of the ROV as a video game,Most ROV’s are quite expensive to build and MOST rov pilots DO NOT OWN the rovs so they tend NOT to be careful when flying the vehicle.
I would not be lying if I said that I have instructed countless Trainees 😀
I would like to think that I have given plenty of experience to people and the trainees have gained important knowledge in flying ROV’s.
Just take heed of a little advice here 😀
Do as you’re bloody told 😀 If the supervisor says do something then do it 👿 At the end of the day HE is the supervisor not YOU , It’s his ass in the sling NOT yours . HE has the experience which is why he is in that position 😕 And if he has not got that experience to begin with SOMEONE IN THE ORIFICE should be sacked 👿
IT IS YOU IN THE ORIFICE that is screwing the rates up and F#@king the way the ROV industry is going .
If the Orifice Twat is prepared to employ a complete Unknown with no experience through an agency then YOU are the guys responsible for turning out complete Numbskulls 😥
The only way to police the ROV industry is via reputation/experience and the only way to sort the wheat from the chaff is via IN HOUSE training which YOU Orifice people should be paying for and putting TRAINEES through the system ON A CONTRACT FOR ATLEAST TWO YEARS.
The trainees certificate of competancy comes from being with the company for over two years , ALL the ROV comapnioes join the same scheme 😛 .
If he OR SHE is no good you let them go and they do not get the certificate of competancy 🙂
Without the Certificate of competancy he cannot go through an agency to say he has the experience thus keeping the Muppets out of the freelance circuit via agencies and the caibre of pilots in the industry goes up 😀
So answer to the question in the topic . 😕
It helps but its all a question of personality
Can YOU listen 😉

[SGB]

I don’t want to throw fuel to the fire that my learned collegue above has started but it does raise the question, have any ex divers made it to the dizzy heights of Supervisor (on merit)?

[SpearROV]

I know a few 🙂
I suppose it depends on how long they have been in the Industry.
When all the construction side of things died down in the early eighties there was a large contingent of divers out of work.
Quite a few Die – Hards came into the industry through the Data Recording window , since they knew the video survey side and knew the platform termoilnology 🙂

[Ray Shields]

I was told that I had something against divers in that thread.

I have nothing specifically, it is just that I feel the absolute starting block or foundation for ROV pilots shoudl be technical, technical knowledge, experience and practise.

Yes, people who play computer games will have good hand/eye co-ordination so could probably fly an ROv well – but can they fix it when it breaks?

Yes, a diver has experience of carrying out operations in the water and, if they have been an offshore diver will have experience in some of the jobs being carried out – but can they fix it when it breaks?

I have always told people that their number one job on an ROV is to maintain and fix it. The flying is the bonus that you get for all your hard work and effort in keeping the beast operational.

This is why I said being a diver on its own does not necessarily mean you can do an ROV job.

Certainly years ago, this seemed to be the case. But this was mainly because ROVs were started by diving companies and people moved across (and the bosses were all divers/ex-divers).

There certainly are ex-divers who are Supervisors and above (James 😆 ) but they are now well past the having to fly and fix it stage – they dont need to know how to do that, they’re in charge, thats for the PTs and Sub Eng’s to do, LoL!

[star]

SIMPLE ANSWER TO THAT… no!!!! why??? BECAUSE THEY ARE DIVERS! 🙄 🙄 🙄 BUBBLE HEADS! 😕 😕 😕 😀 😀 😀 😀 😈

[James McLauchlan]

SIMPLE ANSWER TO THAT… no!!!! why??? BECAUSE THEY ARE DIVERS! 🙄 🙄 🙄 BUBBLE HEADS! 😕 😕 😕 😀 😀 😀 😀 😈

That’s not very constructive.
Would you be able to elaborate on your opinion based on your own personal offshore experience or is it simply limited to…..

BECAUSE THEY ARE DIVERS!

The reason I ask is because I was a diver until 1995 when I switched over to ROV’s. I like to think I was a good pilot and probably may still be, so that makes the original question a genuine point that we should be able to discuss amicably.

Back to the original question.

Ex-Divers have been on the ROV worksite in person. Through previous first hand experience they have first hand knowledge of what makes things tick with regards to construction, recognition of different aspects of the worksite and platform layout when carrying out inspection, especially bottom elevations where there can often be limited vis. Often ROV only guys have no real clue and have to learn the ropes (via video) on that score just as the ex-diver did years ago. When working with divers having an ex-diver in the shack is not a bad thing because he knows the do’s and don’ts when it comes to ROV diver support.

As for the actual piloting side of things. I have seen no end of Ex-Divers turn into good pilots and the same applies to ROV only people. Having said that I have also seen my fair share of ex-divers that can’t fly and will never learn to because they just don’t have what it takes. Equally there are a good number of ROV only types that can’t fly either. It’s nothing to do with whether you are an ex-diver or not. It’s to do with whether, as an individual, you have the ability to learn to fly and improve on it.

[James McLauchlan]

There certainly are ex-divers who are Supervisors and above (James 😆 ) but they are now well past the having to fly and fix it stage – they dont need to know how to do that, they’re in charge, thats for the PTs and Sub Eng’s to do, LoL!

I saw that 😉 😀

[Ray Shields]

So you are dis-agreeing with the statement that Divers make better pilots 😆 They are no better (or worse) than anyone else.

I still like to emphasise to people that they are not just there to fly – too many new people coming into the industry think Pilot and forget the Tech bit.

27 years working with ROVs, I’ve never worked on an ROV job thats involved working with divers in the water. There are so many varied jobs being carried out by ROVs that it is difficult to classify specific types of work that you will be doing. You could spend your entire career doing Drill Support (god help you!). I agree it would be better to have someone with dive experience in the shack when working with divers (same way as Vessel Managers shouldn’t all be ex-surveyors or Dive Superintendents!)

[Andy Shiers]

Men wearing skirts need not reply 😆

[Ray Shields]

Pffft! The Burkas were afraid of them in Carry On Up The Kyber!

[Sarcy]

Ray, 640 years in the offshore industry or wahtever it is, and your ignorance never fails to amaze me.

Tell me why, in your so insignificant opinion, would it make sense to have someone with diver experience in the ROV shack when working with divers? Apart from some newbie, you for example, asking questions like"but what is the yellow hose for in their umbilical?" Or" why does he not wear flippers?" and having a diver handy to give a technical answer is maybe the only possible reason for him to be there. As far as ROV ops go, if you need advice from a diver maybe you are in the wrong job.

Please if you know nothing about one particualr aspect of the job keep your thoughts to yourself, save yourself a lot of embarasment. 👿

[Andy Shiers]

Now now Sarcy 😯
Apart from banter the discussion is a valid one no need to chastise.
He wasna saying you had to have a diver and he wasna saying you did not 🙂
He was just saying the probables 🙂
The terminology might be different but the flying will still be flying 🙂

[Anonymous]

Well i can tell you from first hand experience that an ex bubble head turned ROV head can rise to the top and run an ROV company. So whatever your thoughts about ex sat rats, bottom grubbing onshore trash, offshore rock bolters etc i have done it all and divers unfortunatelty still rise above most of the educated time wasters i see on a fairly continous basis….. is that not right axeman…. 😀

[rovbionic]

having survived 21 years jumping out of bells and logged a few hrs in the pickle I can honestly say from what the last 5 years in the ROV game has is truth be told there are good and bad ex divers .

But I would tend to think those of us who did thier share of sat on construction jobs are more likely to grasp the workscope quicker….not to mentioned I was employed by FMC for the above experiences.

Not being God’s gift to piloting I improve steadily and have learning tools that alot of people in the industry classify as "quick to learn"…..but where I personaly see my past experience show is rigging and improvising when the shite hits the fan.

Above all I don’t know of any 50 year olds that are in my shape……yes there are a few of us who kept our act together…made a bomb and went into other trades on merit they had as a proffessional diver.

You who past judgement on a job you never experienced say more about yourselfs than the subject.

Yep…I survived 4 type 0ne hits, two minor embolisims one burst ear drum that was just the dangers of the job one took for granted.

As far as operational workscopes exposure for one who has been around as long I offer a truck load of support to any job I am involved in and have always maintained the attitude "nothing is impossible…if it comes out of the pickle I either fix it or kill it"!!!

The industry obviously respects and considers such applicable experience an asset to an ROV operation………it is only since I got out of diving have three major ROV contractors dropped a lot of dosh to educate me even more…….this ole frogman gets a go on one of dem new schilling subs next week…nope….no more pulling telemetry cans out to the tool house for me.

Just more experience to add to the CV….hows yours looking STARZ??

[Steve]

Worked with a very few ex divers

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